Training

Saturday, March 31, 2007  by Jim Payne
Category: First Circle, Quixtar Strategy, Balanced Business, Business Support Materials

Thank you all for your comments on the Opportunity Zone regarding our request for ideas to help improve IBO profitability and continue to grow the Quixtar business. The response has been overwhelming. We are consolidating these ideas with the one's we have generated internally and are prioritizing how they might fit into our overall strategic plan. One consistent request was for more training by the company. The good news is that we have already begun work on this and below is some information to share on what we are doing.

1. Training is the key to our vision of creating clear pathways to profitability for IBOs at all levels. We believe that Quixtar must offer the best possible training, at the least possible cost to the IBO or the consumer.

2. We believe this strongly enough that we are creating an executive-level training division at Quixtar to ensure the creation of this training

3. In our long-term strategy we have committed to:

• Develop comprehensive training programs, in conjunction with field leadership, that will include both required and optional modules for all levels of IBOs
• Ensure that the most appropriate source (Quixtar, IBO leader, LOA, etc.) delivers each training element.
• Encourage and recognize field-produced training materials that support and teach IBOs how to build a profitable, balanced business.

4. Over the next 3-5 years:

• IBOs at all levels of achievement thoroughly understand the earnings potential of a balanced business and have realistic expectations of what they must do to reach their goals.
• IBOs are confident that they have the training and support needed to build a balanced business at their own pace and to whatever extent they desire.
• New IBOs, as well as the LOA, view Quixtar as a key source of training and support, and Quixtar-developed content is recognized as an indispensable component in successfully building a balanced business.
• All training, whether mandatory or optional, is delivered through a combination of Quixtar and field resources coordinated to produce the most effective results.
• The majority of field-produced support materials emphasize the "how" of building a profitable, balanced business.

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Comments

Tex said:
March 31, 2007 4:23 PM | #

Great news, when will we see the first training being offered?

Jeffrey said:
March 31, 2007 6:03 PM | #

I am glad to see Quixtar stepping up to the plate with the training. Let's face it. It is a product business. So many times I have heard, "It's a people business." What business isn't a people business? If people don't buy cars, a car dealer can't stay in business. If people don't open a checking or savings account, a bank is out of business. If someone doesn't buy a house, a realtor is out of business.

Another side of the training coin in our business is subjective. It is personal growth and development. There is not much that Quixtar can do in this area except suggest generalities. If you want personal growth and development, you do not need your upline. You need to go to Barnes and Noble or your local library and get personal growth and development books, tapes, or CDs. Also information on how to set and achieve realistic goals is important. I almost never received that from my upline's training. It was just enough information to keep needing more information.

There are many ways to build the business. My Upline teaches that there is only one way. Build an army of self users that get customers by default (a "no"). It does not work for everybody, so my line of sponsorship has a large drop-out rate.

Why not ask the prospect what he/she wants after asking them some pre-qualifying questions? Ask them what their strengths are. It may be sales. It may be building a large organization. Ask them what really feels comfortable to them rather than saying, "This is how you build it and you need this tool and that tool, and you need to go to all the functions." Ask them how fast they want to go. Some people want to go fast. Some just want an extra $200 a month, and if they are pushed, they will quit. No amount of tools will ever replace the personal relationship that can be built when an IBO sponsors someone and personally helps them get started and stays with them until they reach their first goal.

I still think that Quixtar should totally take over the tool systems so that everyone from the brand-new IBO to the Founders Crown Ambassadors would make their money only one way in this business--through the movement of product. I'll give an example why Quixtar should do this:

I have 2 Chevys and I have the repair work done at the dealership. (I never said I was the brightest guy on the block.) Anyway, a few months back, they started to add on to the dealership and remodel it. I started a conversation with someone who was in management there. I asked about all the construction work. He told me that the dealership's owner had to submit the plans to GM. After they received approval, GM sent someone there that supervised the entire project so that it met GM's specifications. He said the control that GM has over their dealers is very extensive. Yes, the local guy owns the business, but GM pretty much tells them how to run it or they pull their franchise.

So, Diamonds: Get rid of your tool systems. There was a time for them, but no more. Keep having your local meetings and record them, then submit the talks to Quixtar and let everyone access them. That will build unity: All lines of sponsorship in line with the company. Is it cross lining? Yeah, so is this blog. What's wrong with that? I used to be told that I couldn't even have a friendship with someone crossline, even with a common sponsor. How nuts and paranoid is that?

I think we're headed in the right direction. Time will tell.

ibofightback said:
March 31, 2007 9:16 PM | #

"required" modules sounds interesting. I believe Amway IBOs in Germany are required to undertaken certain training. Amway Europe IBOs are also limited in how much they're allowed to spend on training in the first 3 months.

Editor's Note:
While the BSM Policy in Europe (including Germany) restricts the amount of money that a new IBO may spend on BSMs in the first 90 days, there is currently no required training.

Katie Pearsall
Editor -- Opportunity Zone

Tex said:
April 1, 2007 10:10 AM | #

Jeffrey: I have a list of well over 300 books that are "approved" by the upline. Many of these are available at the library or online for a fraction of what they cost from the upline. At the very worst, go to B&N and get some PV/BV back for your purchases.    

ibofb: One of the biggies in this business uses the slogan "Set No Limits", and it applies to all areas, ESPECIALLY when it comes to tool purchases.

Anonymous said:
April 1, 2007 11:16 AM | #

I am deeply encouraged by your vision.

I come from a corporate background, so I would imagine that much will be going on behind the scenes at Q before there is a visible/substantial difference in what is available for training purposes. However, to use a lawyerly term, "time is of the essence". Certainly this strategy has been on someone's "to do" list for some time. Your efforts will be attacked whether you wait to get it perfectly right or start now with some basics. So, let's roll.

Sharon

MKingston said:
April 1, 2007 12:03 PM | #

I find this good and bad.  Good that Quixtar needs to provide more product support and training. But the "required" part scares me.  What happened to this being an "independent" business?  I want Quixtar's help, but I don't want to run a Quixtar franchise.  I fear taking too much control would remove the ownership part of this business.  The uplines have too much control by being bullies I guess, and now Quixtar is going to duplicate what they've been fighting for years and become a controlling entity for an IBOs every move?  I know a lot of people who are great business minded individuals that would never own a franchise because of the control factor. It's a job. Not your own business.  The American dream isn't filled with requirements, but opportunities to make it what you want.  I don't want requirements or "this is how you have to do it".  I want opportunities and freedom.  I think Quixtar controls IBOs too much as it is, which is an effect of trying to get the big uplines under control.  I'm now scared.

Derek G said:
April 1, 2007 11:42 PM | #

This is exciting news! As a soon to be IBO I'm encouraged to learn of a structured training progrm to help propel my business. I can't wait til the day I get to walk away from the insurance business!

Brad said:
April 1, 2007 11:57 PM | #

I believe the "required" modules should very much apply to: taxes, hobby vs business checklist, general profit/loss analysis training and some general rules awareness training.

Frank Lee said:
April 2, 2007 9:06 AM | #

OK - Rich said it in '83 and others are saying it now. Sorry big diamonds this has been ripped wide open by the internet and a few brave souls. The time has come for the corp to take over training and put PV or at least BV into the tools. Now lets see something done about the big profits from meetings. This business needs to be about helping people succeed in the Quixtar business, not about helping big leaders pad their pockets with tool and meeting money.

Tex said:
April 2, 2007 10:14 AM | #

Frank - BINGO!

The required training must include the rules (which we were explicitly taught to ignore by upline Platinums and above) and training on the sources of profit (tools versus Q) for the folks Frank mentioned above.

This would fix such a large number of other issues that can be "cussed and discussed" ad infinitum it would make your head spin. Cut off the head of the snake and it goes away, play with it's tail and you get bit (again).

Eric said:
April 2, 2007 11:07 PM | #

I have reduced my time spent looking at this blog because I don't miss a thing when I stay away because the same few people dominate the conversation with their pet issue.  Tex, you even out did yourself this time. "Training "on the sources of profit (tools versus Q" is a reach even for you.  Obviously Quixtar has decided to allow you to hijack their blogs.

To THE issue of this string:  I believe I represent the majority in this business.  I have a family, job, and Quixtar Powered business.  I am in complete agreement that we all need training and if we are productive will always need training.  My concern is with the "requred" training.

Because of the time required by my family and job, in order of priority, I knew I wasn't going to break any records in this business. I wanted something that would allow me to move at the pace I chose.  My company has required training.  I and others feel that a great deal of it is a waste of time but it is required so we go.

Many times people compare this business to a franchise, most of which have required training. I suppose if this was a full time endeavor I wouldn't be so concerned but my time is my time and this busines is part time.  I already hear enough theory from trainers who have never done what I do.

I value training and would welcome any thing that is offered by Quixtar.  I'm even ok with paying for it as I do for trining provided by my LOS because if I pay for it I can choose to use it or not and it puts the onus on the provider.  I already have enough requirements on my time.

Grock said:
April 2, 2007 11:52 PM | #

Big steps in the right direction. This can only strengthen the base of dedicated IBOs and attract new to stay the course with these big improvements on the way.  

Greg said:
April 3, 2007 12:29 AM | #

Our prayers have been answered!

Thanks Jim Payne and Quixtar staff for your insight and leadership. Can't wait for the changes.

What about it everyone. Lets really get behind Quixtar on this. Its time to stop talking and get to work!

IBO's that can't function within the rules are free to move on... There's your freedom MKingston!

We've seen for to  many years what happens when IBO's have too much freedom without the accountability to go with it!

TB 2 IBO said:
April 3, 2007 1:23 AM | #

One Comment Here!

ALL TRAINING (BSM) ARE OPTIONAL.  YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PURCHASE THEM.  

You may go out on your own and do your reading, as Tex suggests, at a library.  You may on your own, find successful IBOs and ask for their help (expect to pay for the information as with any other business).

People make money on the sales of "tools".  I bet you all agree that the original Napster was a good idea too?  If you are good at something, and want to teach it, why shouldn't you be compensated?  Please, 5-8 bucks for a CD, 100 bucks for a weekend seminar is hardly expensive.  There is nothing free in life, and you will have to pay your dues.  

Piet Strydom said:
April 3, 2007 2:42 AM | #

Jim said: Ensure that the most appropriate source (Quixtar, IBO leader, LOA, etc.) delivers each training element.

Piet says: Can you expand on this please?

Training can take place in a number of different places and ways.  Quixtar, for example, will launch an online learning management system this year.  But for some people, seeing and hearing something live is a better bet.  Others need something hands-on.  We need to determine which is the best source to deliver different types of training -- some is best coming from the corporation in terms of continuity and consistency (brand training comes to mind here) yet other types might be best coming from an IBO or LOA.  We don't know what the division looks like yet but the goal is simple -- using the most effective means to get the training to IBOs.

Beth Dornan
Director -- Quixtar Communications

Tex said:
April 3, 2007 9:21 AM | #

Anna,

I consider Eric's post a double standard.

The posts I made on the 70% rule and the questionable website that was selling Q products without any visible "content reviewed", were no worse than Eric complaining about my "hijacking" this thread.

What could be more basic to a business training system than where the money flows for Q products AND the much more lucrative tool profits?

Every IBO should know the amount of tool money being made, it is THE free enterprise/capitalism indicator of where the incentives are.

Eric,

We'll just have to agree to disagree how fundamental the tool profit issue is for our businesses.

Editor's Note:
We're sorry you find there to be a double standard. Moderating comments is more of an art than a science and is obviously subjective. We will continue to do our best to allow differences of opinion while keeping comments civil, on topic, and not redundant.

Katie Pearsall
Editor -- Opportunity Zone

Tex said:
April 3, 2007 10:43 AM | #

TB 2 IBO,

The part that caught me was "...you will have to pay your dues".

When these "dues" make up the vast majority of profit for the higher pins, and this fact is not commonly known, we are way past the point of ethical business dealing.

Ty Tribble said:
April 3, 2007 12:15 PM | #

It's not just the price of the tools, in my opinion, it is the motivation behind the tools sales.

Are the diamond leader tools systems really in place to help the newest person turn a profit in Quixtar, or are they in place to subsidize the Quixtar compensation plan for the diamond leaders?

How many of us heard the following...

"Plug into the proven system for 2-5 years and you will make $250,000/yr"?

If that were true, the CD's would be worth $100/each and weekend seminars would be worth $10,000.

The problem isn't the price of the tools. The problem is the price of the tools that don't work as advertised in the first place.

If the tools are so important to success in Quixtar and if the diamond leaders really care about your success in Quixtar, why not offer the tools for sale AND offer them free online downloads?

Tex said:
April 3, 2007 4:27 PM | #

Ty,

The price of the tools determines the motivation behind the tool sales. If the tools were free or at cost, there is incentive to provide the right, high quality tools to grow the Q business, instead of tool profit.

The tool price and motivation are directly related. The tools are only worth their value in the free market, and the market is not a free market, it is a captive market is aggressively marketed to, that largely does not know about the profits behind the tools. Fix the last concept (knowing about the profit behind the tools), and the free market will function properly.

TB 2 IBO said:
April 3, 2007 9:43 PM | #

Tex,

You name any endeavor, business, sports, marriage, anything.  For those that succeed to the highest levels they must pay their "dues".  This doesn't always translate to money.  However, for our business, what is the dues we pay?

Tools-For motivation, guidance, and relatability (often given for free to new people when they first join, at least this is my experience and what I practice)  I don't consider it a cost, I consider it an investment into my downline (there's a tip for you).

Products-Stuff you need anyway, so you become your own best customer.  Use as much as you can from Q* and partner stores.

Time-It takes time to build this business.  Time you won't get back.  It is about the only thing that doesn't have a refund in this business.  6 MONTHS for everything listed above.

Ego-You will need to put your ego on the line, and expect to get no's, laughed at, ridiculed for doing something different.  Can your ego handle that or are you going to quit at the first no you get?  Also, are you wiling to change your current thought process on how to make money?  Will you think long term success or short term failure?  

That is the "dues" I am referring to.  Not just tools.  I am sure there are few I am leaving out, but that is what I can think of off the top of my head.

Cheers

Eric said:
April 4, 2007 1:31 AM | #

People! Please!

The issue is Quixtar training!!

Tex, I sincerely apologize if I offended you but you clearly wrote on another string "As I have mentioned before, it would be much better to have a "top 3" issues that do not get pushed to the back of the pile as new issues are added. I don't want to put a tool "spin" on new entries, but will do so unless the tool profit topic is given this kind of visibility on the site." I was simply acknowledging your consistency.

Since we are there I fail to see how a price or even profit gives me the insight into someone's intent. That would translate into "profit is evil".  I also don't believe that price guarantees quality.  Its about content.  This market is much more free then people represent in this blog.  The internet has seen to that.  While I do purchase much material my system offers, there is some Diamond's CDs I don't purchase.  I don't judge their motivation, I just figured their style or content doesn't suit me so I don't buy.  I also purchase material from book stores and other sources.  Some is good which causes me to repurchase material by the author and some doesn't suit me so I don't buy again.

Yes, I sometimes even get something for free that is extremely valuable.  Check out the link on Beth's blog. A great tool for many areas of our life.  Is Beth's information more valuable then someone who profits from publishing a book or cutting a CD because I got it for free? It's valuable only because of its content.

Its a slippery slope with no end in sight when we start judging other people's motivation, just as I did when I wrongfully used the term "hijacking" in reference to Tex.  Life gets a whole lot more simpler and easier to comprehend when we personally assess the value of what we are purchasing. It it is worth what we paid then we'll probably be induced to purchase again. If it is not worth what we paid we decide for our selves to no longer purchase. Whether someone's profit was $0.00, $0.10, or $1.00 is not

a concern, did I get value in return is.

Eric said:
April 4, 2007 2:16 AM | #

Greg,

While I don't necessarily agree with MKingston's fear and do agree with you in that we need accountability in all areas of our life isn't "IBO's that can't function within the rules are free to move on... There's your freedom MKingston!" more then just a little harsh? Isn't freedom versus regulation a constant in our lives in all areas? It would seem to be an ideal subject for a forum such as this.

While I have never seen Quixtar do anything that would make me "scared" the required concept does concern me because of my experiences with required training at my job from people that don't have a clue.  The possible next step is where my concern increases.  The people responsible for the training sensed the resistance and boredom of their audience so then we had required testing to see if we comprehended their nonsense.  I saw employees, who report to me, get demerits on their record for scoring poorly on the tests while they excelled at their jobs.

The problem was the presenters determined the content, success criteria, and evaluation.  That is why I commented earlier I would prefer to pay a fee versus being required.  If it is my money I can walk out.  Evaluation is also much simpler.  It is results.  If there are no results then maybe its not the audience.

In fairness to Quixtar, our system arranges for Quixtar training 2 or 3 times a year as they bring a body of knowledge that our upline does not have.  The presentations are both promoted and well received by the attendees.  If what I have seen is what is in mind then maybe my concerns are unfounded.  I just don't want to be required by anyone to waste what little time I have now.  This is a "part time" business for me and many others.

Piet said:
April 4, 2007 3:56 AM | #

Tex said: that largely does not know about the profits behind the tools.

Piet says: Two comments -

1. Tex, you have your own thread to carry on about tool profits, please do it there.

2. Anybody that doesn't know about tool profits has spent the last 20 years on a different planet.

Please understand that the majority of IBO's WANT the training and the tools, because we pay for it. And believe me, it is worth it.

But bear in mind, not everybody that buys a physics handbook is going to become an Einstein. Do you want to ban physics handbooks as well, because a. somebody makes money on it, and b. not everybody is successful when using it?

Tex said:
April 4, 2007 11:10 AM | #

TB 2 IBO,

I agree there are "dues", but what you have mentioned are obviously needed to build a business. However, only one of them is not openly discussed, and that is the tool profits (there's a tip for you).

Eric,

... I never said or implied "profit is evil". In fact, I think profit is good. However, there must also be a sense of openness between IBO's and the higher pins regarding the tool profits, or the labels of "business partner" and "teammate" are inappropriate. It is also inappropriate to display a lifestyle coming mainly from tool profits, and imply it came from Q.

Piet,

Anna and others will determine where I should post something, not you. Not me, either. The topic is training, and I think training on the rules and the business models (Q and tools) are both appropriate training topics.

I believe you are mistaken about tool profits. If everyone knows the level of tool profits, why are they not regularly talked about, as they make up the vast majority of profit for the higher pins? Why would THE major source of income from a business not be openly discussed?

I also want training and tools, but not at the prices available from upline. I don't expect everyone to become a Diamond with the tools, but this is not a valid excuse for making far more profit on tools than Q and not being open regarding this fact.    

Editor's Note --

Portions of the commit have been omitted for violating Ada-tudes civil discourse policy. Also, we have made a decision to allow tools conversation to take place on this thread as it is closely tied to the issue of training. That said, the intent of the original post is to share Quixtar's plans for offering training and more comments, questions and suggestions specific to that are certainly welcome.

Thanks,

Anna Bryce
Managing Editor -- Quixtar Opportunity Zone

Tom said:
April 4, 2007 2:13 PM | #

WOW!!

What's going on here?!

This conversation is going nowhere.  I didn't see in Jim's original message that started this thread that anything was mandatory.  He was telling us about some great new programs that were being created for our benefit at Quixtar's expense and this has turned into something quite different.

I agree that some things like the compensation plan and the rules should be learned and abided by...for all of our sakes.  I also agree that there should be limits on the rules and requirements to allow us to maintain our Independence in our businesses Powered by Quixtar.

I think it's great that Quixtar is making great strides in the area of training and personalization for our businesses.  Our business is constantly improving.

BSMs are optional.  While learning from others' experiences creates relatability and allows us to avoid certain things that seem to come along while building this business, it is not a requirement to purchase CDs or attend events that might allow us to see a bigger picture to this business...even if it makes a nice 'vacation' from our normal routine.

Most successful people find that personal growth is important to greater success in most any honorable endeavor.  Barnes & Noble offers PV/BV to invest in ourselves to that end.  This is also not mandatory.

Complaining about what everyone else is doing and who is to blame for our woes is also an option.  Unfortunately, this is the easiest and most common option taken.  It requires no effort but no reward either.

So, a good question to ask might be "Are my conversations and actions going to advance me toward my goals or are they slowing me down?"

This business has never been better than it is today.  And the intentions and improvements in progress are intended for our benefit.

I choose to be grateful and excited about what is going on and look forward to the future!

TB 2 IBO said:
April 4, 2007 3:35 PM | #

Tex,

Maybe systems to disclose the profit potential tied up with tools.  Mine sure does.  However, I will be frank with you.  Since they are private entities they are under no obligation to disclose it.  

That being said, I have seen nowhere, either through talks or demonstrations where the tools are business.

My LOA is open about the potential to earn additional income, but first and ONLY first by developing a properly structured, profitable Q* business.

Even then, you can make a varying amount of money, not just from sales of tools (which are the lowest margins), but from the number of talks you do within the system.  These are not forced upon anyone, you will be in demand based on your success.  The more talks you do, the more money you can earn.

Quick example;  Bill Clinton makes far more money doing speeches around the world than he ever did while President.  Does this make him evil?  Of course not.  Does it make him greedy?  No of course not.  He is askedto do these talks and these people are WILLING to pay him (I heard 100k per talk in some instances). Because there is an apparent value associated with it.

I am all for any and all help Quixtar is going to provide to IBOs.  However, my guess is they will not touch the business training aspect.

Tex said:
April 4, 2007 4:12 PM | #

TB 2 IBO,

I am not sure the exact meaning of your first couple of paragraphs, there appear to be a couple of words missing.

However, the key differences between the speakers in Q and Bill Clinton, are:

1. You identified the amount of money he earns for his speeches, you can't for your upline,  

2. Bill Clinton is not claiming to be helping you build a business,

3. Bill Clinton does not have a "captive" market (saying the tools are optional, then turning around and saying nobody has ever succeeded without them, which is not my definition of optional), and

4. Bill Clinton does not display his lifestyle as being based on his Presidential pay when most of it is a result of his speaking pay.

If Q does not touch the business training aspect, they will have neglected to fix THE major reason why the A/Q business has been stagnant in North America for over a decade. That would be very unfortunate for the future of Quixtar, in my opinion.

Eric said:
April 4, 2007 6:41 PM | #

Anna,

While recognizing you have the final responsibility to determine if a topic is on topic I respectfully disagree with your conclusion.  Jim's original post was about "Quixtar" training with the added suggestions of requirements. That is a new element that is worthy of discussion as it brings a whole new dynamic to the business. Tools, on the other hand, is a topic that is had been discussed ad nauseum.

Having written that I might as well plunge ahead.  There seems to be a general consensus that profit is not near the issue in a market that is open and that the "captive" nature of the marketplace skews things. Captive is a word I see used repeatedly.  Sometimes when we say something enough it seems to get accepted as fact.  Who is captive, the IBO who purchases or the system provider who sells?

Material to build this business proliferates the web. I can choose to purchase from upline, Barnes & Noble, other book stores, other buisness trainers.  I am no one's captive. I can choose to and do attend seminars conducted by my upline and also seminars conducted by Quixtar trainers, as I mentioned in another post.  I see numerous offers for business building seminars related to this business offered by others but have chosen not to purchase.  I am no one's captive.

The system tool providers are definitly held captive, by virtue of their Quixtar contract. in that they can only provide their service to their downline affiliated IBOs.  Perhaps 15 years ago, before the advent of the internet, there may have been an argument that the downline was captive but today that is a canard that clearly ignores that multitude of sources that are readily available today to anyone with an internet connection.

Actually I suppose I am captive in one area.  My company provides required training but in my relationship with my upline I choose, an option that no captive has.

Tom said:
April 4, 2007 7:05 PM | #

If you don't want to attend an event or buy a CD (whether or not you get anything out of it) DON'T.

If you already know what you need to know to build your business successfully, DO IT.

What matters to me is how much I earn.  If someone else makes a profit from helping me learn how to build become successful building this business, GOOD.

If I find I'm not benefiting from the events and tools, I DON'T BUY THEM.

If I find things that will help me grow and become a more successful business person outside of my LOA, I BUY IT.

What doesn't make sense is to be consumed with other people's business and complain about how mine isn't going anywhere.

I am not a victim.  I am responsible for my own actions as well as my success or failure.  I will seek out the tools I need or create them myself (and have Quixtar approve it).

Things are not as they once were in the LOA tool program.  HOORAY!!  Things are not perfect and will always have room for improvement and change.

Anything Quixtar produces will benefit us because it will be consistant and not be influenced by any LOA.  Just because Quixtar creates a brochure for us doesn't mean we have to buy it if we don't want.  There may be some profit in it for them but they deserve it.  So does our LOA deserve to profit from their efforts to help us.  If we don't find value in what they offer, we can choose not to buy it or attend the event.

If I go to the grocery store and buy a loaf of bread, I don't stop and ask the grocer how much he is profiting on the bread before I decide to buy it.  There is an understood benefit that it will help me with my hunger.  I can check the nutrition label between different brands that all assume the same benefit and choose whether or not to buy it.  If the bread meets my expectations I am grateful.  If not, I find something that will.

Gratitude will change an attitude.  And if we can't be grateful, we can quit and go find something that does make us happy!

It's far better to find ways to build with what we have from where we are than to complain about why things aren't already built properly for us.  Be a leader.  Make things happen.  Reap the rewards.

Tom said:
April 4, 2007 7:14 PM | #

I found out the other day that The Learning Lab at Quixtar is releasing QuixtarUniversity.com soon.  It is being released to a few LOAs already.  I don't know the details but I think this is a great start.  Does anyone else have any more knowledge of this?

Editor's Note from Beth Dornan: Quixtar will launch Quixtar University, an online learning program, later this year. Some IBOs are testing portions of this through the Learning Lab, groups of Platinums who test different ideas for us. 

 

Chris O. said:
April 4, 2007 7:57 PM | #

This IS a good place to talk about tool profits in regards to IBO training--but not so we can force our Diamonds to reveal their incomes. Frankly, I don't care how much of their income at that level comes from training tools and speaking fees. I look forward to the day when another stream of income opens up for me--and who says that new streams of income have to yield less than the original stream that created the opportunity?? What I DO care about is knowing what I have to do to achieve MY goals--that's where the training comes in.

I'm a "Show Me" kind of gal, so I never take anyone's word for something that I have the means to figure out for myself--and being able to calculate both what I can expect to make with my current LOS, as well as what I need to add to make it to where I want to be is an essential part of training. Training that NEEDS to be handled by Quixtar, so it is uniform, and presented in the same way to every IBO until they KNOW IT!

There are also the one-time bonuses and incentives earned along the way that go into the profit figures and are not necessarily tied directly to PV--that is something that Q ought to take over training on, as well. We all need to know how many different ways we can make money in this business--that comply with Q rules and regs, and which ones don't. These are the areas where Q has to take the lead in training--and not just as a hit-or-miss find on the website or pages of printed diagrams and figures in the Reference Book that I doubt many IBO's are truly able to understand OR re-create for themselves. Ideally, Q would create some video training modules--maybe interactive--?? (Hint: Q it would be very nice to have a business index for IBO's on the Q site so we can actually find what we are looking for the second time, after having found it by accident the first time--like the offline ordering module!!)

And Tex, as far as your comments on a "captive audience" are concerned: Every motivational/self-growth/success coach writer/speaker I know of starts by selling a book, which all us hopefuls buy, and in which they give us a lot of good stuff, but they always tell us we don't get the full deal unless we come to one of their workshops that cost ONLY$3995...tell me, isn't every one who reads the book and wants to find out more about how to attain the same things the author did a "captive audience"? Do any of us know how much of that very large fee they get? Do we know how that income compares to the income from the sales of the book? NO--and I have never heard one person who wanted what they were selling, and willing to pay for it ask the question. WHY is this such an issue for YOU?

Jeffrey said:
April 5, 2007 12:39 AM | #

I have followed all the postings since the Opportunity Zone started a couple months ago. I have to say this: Yes, I have had major problems with my upline Diamond. I currently have a complaint against him in the rules department as I speak. I didn't want to do it, but Beth encouraged me to do so, and now I'm glad I did. I have considered quitting numerous times but I didn't want to lose what I had. I even seriously considered it as recently as last week.

Yes, I get frustrated that the PV is so low compared to the current prices. I get really frustrated that I still have to buy case lots of many, many products. It is maddening that I cannot buy one jar of peanut butter or just 2 C batteries. I wouldn't use 12 C batteries in 10 years. I will start buying case lots and not complain when Quixtar employees go to the grocery store and buy everything in case lots themselves. Until then, I'm going to pout about it. I get mad when I think of all the baloney the Diamonds get away with in the tool department. It also frustrates me that we've been talking about some of these things for months and even years and there is not much change.

But, I also have a conventional business. If I want to run a small classified ad in the local paper, it is a minimum of $200 for one month. If I want to hire help, that opens up a whole new can of worms. Ever dealt with the government when it comes to business regulations and taxes? When you're wrong, you lose and when you're right, you lose.

The whole point of my ranting is that this business, with all that's wrong with it, has a lot that's right with it. When I get frustrated, I forget that someone recently went Diamond right under my nose. They lived six blocks away from me. My complaint in the rules department is being handled very professionally. I have already decided that if my Diamond wants to do the right thing and pay the roll-up, that's great; if he wants to be a jerk and not do it, fine. I'll just go Platinum and then I won't have to deal with him anymore.

I say, let's quit talking and all start to build our businesses. This is the only thing I've ever found that keeps paying me for work I did in 1999.

So Beth, Jim, Todd, Ray, Robin, and even you, Tex, I'm coming to Grand Rapids in June. I might have an occasional attitude check now and then in the meantime, but I'll be there. And I will have a bigger business than I have today.

Gene said:
April 5, 2007 12:51 AM | #

Tex,

since you have researched the tools issue, and have followed it amongst may webpages, blogs, and personal discussions, and since it is your pet issue on the opportunityzone,  and since you feel the tools systems are so profitable for "someone else" please enlighten us all out here with our heads in the clouds as to who exactly has succeeded in building this business, in its present form (quixtar, not amway) without the tools???

Frank Lee said:
April 5, 2007 9:29 AM | #

I can see an opportunity here for Quixtar to improve training, add consistency, and make tool and training costs reasonable.

How about a subscription service for online audio and e-books? An IBO could pay a reasonable flat fee, say $100/year and get a I-tunes - like interface that would allow streaming and/or download of audio and video, and download of e-books.

There could even be a sort of "parental controls" system,  for lack of a better term, that upline could use to tailor content to downline needs.

I would like to hear what others think of this.

This business is supposed to be designed as a system where people at all levels profit from the motion of Q products through their networks. It is not supposed to be a business where the big pins turn their biggest profits through tools and training at the expense of the little guy.

I think that my suggestion would at least address a good part of the problem by making tools affordable to all.

Brad said:
April 5, 2007 10:05 AM | #

Hey Jeffrey,

Just a thought on your "case lots" -- can you not just split it up, take what you want (in this case, 2 C batteries) and sell the others?  It is your business and your products, right?  Order a case of 4 peanut butters, and work it out with your neighbors, family, or friends and have them purchase the other 3 from you at: SRP of case / 4.  

Tex said:
April 5, 2007 12:32 PM | #

Gene,

Nobody that I know of has succeeded without tools, but this is not a valid excuse for most of the profit coming from tools and not being open about this fact. I support tools, but also support being honest and open about the profits they generate.

Janet said:
April 5, 2007 1:56 PM | #

Will VideoPlus be partnering to produce the training materials?

Janet,

Quixtar partnered with VideoPlus last year on an issue of Success From Home
magazine. While we are planning to produce another issue of Success From Home in 2007, I'm not aware of any other materials planned with VideoPlus.

Thanks,

Anna Bryce
Managing Editor -- Opportunity Zone

Jeffrey said:
April 5, 2007 2:38 PM | #

Brad,

Splitting up case lots, stocking some of it, using some of it, and selling the rest of it to downline IBOs and retail customers sounds like the old Amway call-in/pick-up days and defeats the entire concept of everyone placing their own orders on the website. When you have a 300 horsepower Cadillac STS, do you really want to go back to an old covered wagon? You can't bring the sins of the old business into a new business and slap a new name on it and "hope" everyone doesn't figure it out. I'll take it a step further. I can go to the grocery store and buy ONE SINGLE energy bar. I can buy ONE can of Red Bull. I can buy a bubble pack of TWO C batteries. Add it up yourself. If you need 25 different items from Quixtar and five or even ten of those items are only in case lots, which ones don't you buy? Most people wouldn't buy anything from Quixtar. They would go to the store and buy everything. Q loses thousands of orders and literally thousands upon thousands of dollars every single day because of this insane practice. There is a real simple solution. Get rid of it. Today would be a good time to do it. I'm just not going to get off of it until it's fixed. Quixtar: How much money do you make on products that sit in the warehouse because people do not want to buy a case? I know what they do. It doesn't move fast enough, so they discontinue it rather than find out WHY is wasn't moving. It drives me crazy.  

Beth Dornan said:
April 5, 2007 3:51 PM | #

Jeffrey, I'm glad you're sticking it out and look forward to meeting you in person in June!

Gene said:
April 5, 2007 7:48 PM | #

Tex,

so let me get this straight... you think the tools are a rip off.  You disagree with the prices of the tools, but you dont know of a SINGLE case where someone went Diamond w/o the tools?  

lets say that the tools were RIDICULOUSLY expensive- lets say you paid $500 per month to your upline diamond for "tools" which encompases the CD's, books, tapes, seminars, him holding your hand on a moonlit night, whatever it takes.  So you spend $6000 per year on "tools" (I have NEVER heard of anyone spending that much either, but lets just use it as a "what if").  IF it took you 20 years to go Diamond, then you have invested a total of $120,000 in tools (and wrote them off your taxes, either your Job payroll tax, and got a bigger refund, your business, and paid less self employed tax, or got a refund, or it lessend your tax burden in total)  So what does the average Diamond make per year?  lets say it was only $100,000 per year, and we all know that it is larger than that, after 2 years you have recouped all you have ever spent in the last 20, and made a profit.   Now you hide in a cave in the deepest, darkest place you can, and the money keeps coming in....and in.....and in....  Not too bad of a deal.

I understand you disagree with the idea that some systems make large incomes off "tools", but the bottom line is that those same Emeralds, Diamonds, EDC, Doubles, Tripples, Crowns, Crown Ambasadors, etc. also have paper assets, art collections, real estate, and other busineses possibly.  Should they have to disclose to you how much they make off of it all to you?  Why?  They started in the same place as you, building a business from the ground floor, helping others do the same, and that was the financial base for them to create thier financial empire.  They did not start out making big bucks off the tools, and lied and said it was Quixtar.  They started where we ALL start.

rara said:
April 5, 2007 7:55 PM | #

Jeffrey,

Have you thought of buying your peanut butter and C batteries from a regular store?  Surely, you don't get that much PV/BV from them, and you won't be spending money on product that you may never get to use before they expire (like the 10 C batteries).  Then you can buy the core products from Quixtar.

Just a suggestion.

Brad, I think your idea sounds good at face value, but the more I think about it, if my friend/relative wanted to sell me a jar of regular peanut butter, I would be quite taken aback.  I would expect them to just give it to me if they didn't want it.

TB 2 IBO said:
April 6, 2007 12:14 AM | #

Ok,

Last comment on the this tool thing.  Obviously you won't convince Tex otherwise.  However, I will let the rest of you know that once you become a major player in the business (at least where my LOA stands), strong Platinum and Emerald, you are briefed on the income potential available once you start teaching.

That being said, my LOA suggests the automatic CD every week and one book a month.  However, you can also download and listen to these selected CDs via MP3 streaming audio for FREE.  Yes I said it FREE.  Imagine that.  I will point out that they are for personal use as is any copyrighted information.

A couple comment on Tex's answers:

1) I didn't identify his income.  It is what was heard.  It would be hard to find what exactly he was paid.  Not to mention all of the Star treatment besides the cash.  Much like the speculation reported by people with a grip about tools--in this day and age.

2) No, but he does often tell his life story and what it took for him to succeed.  He also recommends what people do to succeed for themselves in life.

3) His market is captive.  They pay money for tickets, dinners, etc to hear him talk.  That is a captive audience.  Making kids sit in a high school gym, then bringing him to do a talk is not a captive audience.  Learn you definitions!  Oh, yes please give us an example of an IBO that has not used a system to go Diamond.  I think I also read on this site one of the authors state this same statement.(I could be mistaken)

4) We need not get into a political debate here.  But I hope you understand, a very LARGE portion of his income came from campaigning.  Using the matching funds clause, he made lots during his 8 years.  Oh guess what, on the tax payers dollars. Dang!

Just a side note:  Jeffery I am also very glad to hear you are sticking it out despite your obstacles!  You will be a true testament to the power and potential of this awesome business and opportunity.  I am proud to be in the same pursuit of common goals as you!  

Jeffrey said:
April 6, 2007 3:10 AM | #

Beth, thank you for your encouragement. I really appreciate it.

I also want to clarify something: just because I can buy eaches at the store, doesn't mean I do. On my budget, I can only buy so much per week, so when items come in case lots, I have to do lots of shuffling, deleting, and postponing. If I could buy smaller quantities, I could order everything on my list each week. Some times I have to search the Partner Stores to see if I can buy things in smaller quantities.

Tex said:
April 6, 2007 5:43 PM | #

Gene,

Yes, my point is the tools are a rip off. It isn't because of the price per se, but because of the profit that price generates and results in the upline misrepresenting (that's the nicest word I can think of, given the "family channel" nature of this blog) the source of their lifestyle, which is from the tool profits, not the Q profits.

Although you attempted to portray a "RIDICULOUSLY" high tool cost, the out of pocket expense of $500/month is not far off, when travel, hotels, car rentals, meals, etc., for 2 people are factored in. Granted, much of this money does find its way to the upline's pocket, but it does come out of the IBO's pocket.  In order to go and maintain Diamond, many hundreds of people will have the same costs. Does this sound like a good business model to you?

Just because the current Emeralds and above paid into this system does not mean it needs to continue. This is a business, not a college fraternity, we don't need to continue the financial hazing. What protected them in the past is the truth was not widely known, now it is, so it's time for a change.

I have no desire to know how much money they make from other areas, such as real estate, other businesses, etc., just Q and tools. However, keep in mind those other businesses were largely funded by the same tool profits I have an issue with. What if someone robbed a bank and then invested the money on Wall Street and made a big profit, would you let him keep it?

rara,

I agree with the beginning part of your post, Jeffrey shouldn't think he needs to buy the lower PV items if it doesn't make sense to him. Some IBO's will find the PV and convenience worthwhile, others will not. If enough IBO's follow this practice, Q will either lower the price or not carry these items, simple supply and demand.

However, the part about giving away the peanut butter is a bit "nutty" (pardon the pun), in my opinion. At least some of your friends/relatives should be aware you are in business and willing to help, assuming they are not allergic to peanuts.

TB 2 IBO,

Your MP3 recordings are free? How much does the  site cost that you download these "free" recordings from every month?

Also, why should you have to wait to become a strong Platinum or Emerald to find out about the level of tool profits? Aren't they proud of this income? Wouldn't knowing about this income as a prospect make the business MORE attractive?

1. A quick google found this regarding speaking fees for BC: http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/06/14/bill.clinton.speeches/index.html Turns out the $100,000 should be considered his minimum. The point is not how much he makes, but that it is known. AND he is not promoting joining him in a business and misrepresenting the source of his wealth. That is another point, it is not hard to find MANY facts with the internet, as it was in pre-internet days. This includes tool profit facts.

2. Most of BC's stories are NOT about he rose to be a success, they are about politics, foreign policy, economic policy, etc.

3. His audience is there by choice, they paid for the tickets. Most IBO's are there because they have been sold on the idea they need to be there to succeed, and many IBO's (including me) will tell you if you pull back from the systems being promoted, the upline support evaporates.

4. I am not an expert on campaign money, but I don't think he has nearly the access to campaign funds as he does to his speaking fees.

Mark Welsh said:
April 7, 2007 11:58 AM | #

Personally I see the tools as training and motivation. If you take a look at a Diamond business, there are at minimum 400 to 600 IBO's in that organization.  Do you really expect and believe they can help each individual person succeed and have a life with their own families all by themselves? That would take an astronomical amount of time to do without some sort of a system in place to help train people. I believe you can help more people help themselves by providing taining through audio, literature and seminars. It's all about keeping it simple. And you can't expect people to provide expertise for free. My upline doesn't charge me for the gas they use when they come to do meetings for me and nobody shows up.

If I fail in this business its because I have missed the opportunity not because my upline is making money off me.

This business is for everyone. Get excited about the opportunity!

Tex said:
April 7, 2007 2:05 PM | #

Should have stated in previous note, "Granted, much of this money does not find its way to the upline's pocket, but it does come out of the IBO's pocket.

Beth Dornan said:
April 9, 2007 2:55 PM owner | #

In response to Tom's April 4 question about Quixtar University ... Quixtar is testing an online learning program called Quixtar University with several IBO groups.  We plan to roll out our training program to all IBOs later this year.  Watch Quixtar.com for further details.

Miia said:
April 10, 2007 7:35 AM | #

Tex,

Do you think that your upline support evaporated because you were not part of the tool system or could it be that they got tired of having to deal with the same complaints, weather its about the tool profit or another issues, over and over again?  I compare it to calling a friend on the phone that was in a bad relationship that ended years prior and they are still complaining about it.  I no longer call them or want to associate with them because whenever we get together it’s the same old sob story.  

I personally have backed off on the amount of time I spend reading on this site because it’s the same complaint over and over again. While you make SOME valid points, it does make each thread in the blog useless.  

Greg said:
April 10, 2007 11:45 AM | #

Beth, I have heard somewhere on this blog that someone received authorization to use the shadow figure plan (Quixtar opportunity) outside the Quixtar site.  Why not put this presentation on DVD format and make it available to ALL IBO's. Its a really clever presentation!

Would Quixtar ever consider doing regionals again? After reading through the opportunityzone blog it sounds like many IBO's would like more company sponsored functions.

 

Editor's Note from Beth Dornan:  Great idea...we'll definitely consider, but after we give it a much-needed overhaul. 

And yes, we are considering doing regionals again.  Last year Quixtar Canada hosted a Doug DeVos swing through several Canadian cities and we're looking at doing the same in the U.S. later this year.  If you can't wait that long, of course, there's Quixtar Connections right here in Grand Rapids, Mich., on June 9.

Joecool said:
April 10, 2007 2:27 PM | #

I hope this doesn't "evolve" to where QMO uplines teach their downline IBOs that they need complete dedication to the QMO teaching system in addition to the corporation driven training.  

Tex said:
April 10, 2007 5:06 PM | #

Miia,

I never said anything that could even be misinterpreted as complaining to my upline about anything, especially the tool profits.

We were "model" IBO's, often being singled out for being "loyal", as we often traveled several hours to be at a training session, Christmas party, even an Open Opportunity meeting once or twice, when a new technique was being introduced.

We made our own decision to go off of the system, which resulted in dead silence. No phone calls to let us know they were passing through town as in the past, no e-mails to extra events, training sessions, Christmas parties, etc., as in the past.

Just... dead... silence. Sometimes silence says a lot.

How do my valid points make each thread in the blog "useless"?

Editor's Note:
We're publishing this comment here as it's a response to a previous comment, but this particular conversation is beginning to veer off the topic of training. Discussions about the value of tools that aren't related to the idea of Quixtar providing training -- i.e. discussions about individual experience with tools -- would be most appropriate on the T word thread.

Katie Pearsall
Editor -- Opportunity Zone

Jeffrey said:
April 10, 2007 7:28 PM | #

There is so much talk about the tools that it is wearing me out. What ever happened to a sponsor actually sitting down with a brand-new IBO and saying, "What are 2 or 3 burning desires that you want from this business that you cannot get anywhere else?" "How soon would you like to get there?" "How much time and effort are you willing to put forth to achieve these goals?" "How much actual income would you like to make per month?" And the most important: "Do you really want to be the owner of your own business?" (Betcha never heard that one from your upline!) No, instead, the upline will say, 'Well, to succeed, you need to get on standing order CD, book of the month, and here are two tickets to the next function. All the leaders will be there." That's pretty much what I got. Then I was "expected" to do all those things or I wasn't serious. They never even heard anything I was saying.

As I get going again, I plan on using NO tools, just to prove it can be done without them. I will find out what my new IBO's goals are. I will help them establish how much time and effort it will take: How many customers do they need? How many presentations do they need to show? By using the product checklist, what products do they use in their home? Then showing them some basic product demos and cost comparisons. Helping them with their list and making their first appointments. Then going with them on appointments until they and I feel they are ready to go out on their own. I would be willing to bet that the average time spent with a new IBO getting them started is less than a week. I don't think that's enough time. You might have to hold someone's hand for a month or two to get them started and build a firm BV foundation and a good front line. It might take longer initially, but in the long run, as you teach it to them and they in turn teach it to others, it will pay off long term.

Can you imagine what kind of volume the company would be doing if you actually helped someone get 20 customers that bought $45 per month and showed them through example (100% personal use), product demos, and cost comparisons, how to do 100 to 300 PV personal use every month? Most IBOs, from my observation, ESPECIALLY those on the system, do from 20 to 50 PV personal use. They have just a smattering of retail, mostly from family. Mostly because their sponsor never took serious time with them to get them started right on the products.

This business is very uncomfortable for most people, even after they have been in for awhile. I plan on giving my new people the help and support I never got. If you are doing 100 to 300 PV personal use and you are doing 300 to 400 PV retail, and you have 2 or 3 people that you've trained to do that, you can have a better posture when showing new people because you know it really works. Let me emphasize: confidence, not cockiness, because you've actually worked for it. People can tell whether or not you've actually done what you're talking about.

You could start a race carrying a 100 pound bag of potatoes with you. Yes, it will initially strengthen muscles you didn't know you have. But, in the end, you will lose the race because it is bogging you down. That's what the tool systems do. They initially give you some knowledge and some duplicateability. But in the end, they just wear you down. This business is so simple: Set a believeable goal with a deadline, use the products, share and sell the products, show the opportunity, review your business progress with your sponsor monthly, and teach others to do the same.

TB 2 IBO said:
April 11, 2007 1:11 AM | #

I think the presentation idea is a good one.  Like Anna says, it does need serious overhauling!  The presentation does seem vague, and their needs to be counterpoints to the standard criticisms. Example: Pyramid--why it is not one.  

That way if you are showing to someone across the country it nips these concerns in the proverbial butt.

ibofightback said:
April 11, 2007 3:58 PM | #

Jeffrey, your "whatever happened to" is exactly what we do. Establish their dream, establish desired income, work out time frames, go through product checklists, do product demos, help with the list, do appointments, show plans with them (at least 5)

I don't know what your system, but your "whatever happened to" is exactly what we do in our system

Greg said:
April 12, 2007 2:34 PM | #

Hi again Beth,

TB 2 IBO April 11 has a good point on dealing with  questions in the plan about objections and  negative image etc.  Quixtar, I'm sure, has a  pretty good handle on what objections IBO's run into when showing the plan or approaching customers.

I know what I run into most, but I'm curious what Quixtar considers the top 3 most difficult objections  for IBO's to overcome.  What is Quixtars approach to helping new IBO's to overcome these objections. What is Quixtars plan for eliminating the source of the negative image that cause the objections?

I have watched the "Quixtar Facts" and have used this with prospects. It has not been very effective! Also, "Thiz Biz Now" sounds like a commercial for Quixtar by people who have an obvious reason to say some nice things.

I think we IBO's need tools and training that can only come form Quixtar to help over come the road blocks! My feeling is, the training from the field gets off track and causes more problems then are solved. An example would be the Proctor and Gamble situation just  to name one of many such legal confrontations.

What say you Beth?

 

Editor's Note from Beth:  Some of the answers to your questions are here in Ada-tudes and over at Inside Quixtar and Real Quixtar Blog.  Our First Circle strategy is all about addressing what needs to be improved about our business in five key categories -- product, training, compensation, relationships, and reputation. You said it yourself....fix the source and you fix the issue. 

"The Facts About Quixtar" DVD addressed a handful of issues identified by IBOAI as being important to IBOs.  But they aren't the only ones.

What I've heard in terms of objections include questions about the price/value of products and the time needed to build a business.  I'll need to go back and do a little research to come up with an official "top three."  

TB 2 IBO said:
April 12, 2007 3:45 PM | #

Greg,

My only comment here is that people are going to find exactly what they are looking for.  

If they are looking for excuses why not to build the business they will find it, and you know as well as I you can reference sources on the net.  Mostly, to websites full of quitters that make each other feel good about quitting.

However, if they are truly looking for an opportunity and all the things that are right about it, they will find this information as well.  You can also reference them to sources.

What most people do not understand is you simply can not talk a person into this business (that would be sales).  You need to show them by example.  Examples:  

1)Showing them you use the products.  Take them on a tour of your house (hopefully you are loaded up with your own products--otherwise it would be embarrassing).

2)Showing them how to sponsor people: for them in their business.

3)Helping them develop a budget, and retailing product to customers.

4)Being accountable to someone other than them (namely your upline)

Those are just a few.  The common theme is personal responsibility for their success.

I know it sounds cliche, but it is true.  You can't keep a winner from winning, and you can't keep a quitter from quitting.  Go through the numbers and find the winners!

ibofightback said:
April 12, 2007 3:48 PM | #

I agree with the comments re ThisBizNow. A few negative blog posts from what appear to be "real" people or an article in a newspaper with a misleading or wrong understanding of the business have incredibly much more influence on a prospect than a slick site like thisbiznow.com

In many ways it's tooo slick.

One of the reasons why network marketing has a real opportunity over the next decade is that people are starting to stop believing slick advertisements and campaigns. People want to check out a product? They google it. People want to check out a company? They google it.

They find the corporate sites, for us or any other product/business, but they take them with a grain of salt because they *know* it's going to be all positive spin there.

IMO our biggest problem is the virtual non-existence of positive-spin stories from real people on the 'net. True IBO Stories will help - but it's still a corporate site. There's gotta be a way to get more "independent" third party stuff on the 'net.

TB 2 IBO said:
April 12, 2007 4:02 PM | #

One more thing, I know I am no Quixtar, but I like the idea of what common things people say about the business.  Putting them here will be benefitial.  Have you seen www.factsaboutquixtar.com?  This is a good reference.

Most are covered there.  My personal experiences are as follows;

1) The guy at the top makes all the money.

2) What is my guarantee I will make money?

3) Oh, so this is a recruiting business right?

Those are my most common question/objections.

What is yours?

ibofightback said:
April 12, 2007 5:56 PM | #

yes, I've been thinking of doing a "dumb questions/comments that aren't really dumb" area on my site. One I've had a few times -

If the products are so good, why don't they sell them in shops?

Greg said:
April 13, 2007 2:36 AM | #

TB 2 IBO,

I really don't want to turn the "Training" issue into a _ _ _ _ _ match as to whether or not people who quit should be called quitters and losers. Thats exactly the kind of talk we don't need to hear. Its that kind of language that really turns people off. Even if its true, it's very unprofessional. It's the kind of thing we hear from stage and on tapes. This language may stir the souls of thousands of IBO's at a function, but years of this message has turned people who have quit into an amy of Q/A haters who won't even buy the products.  How people feel when they leave this buisness has a huge impact when multiplied by thousands over the years. We don't need to make things worse by calling them names. "Hung by the tongue". Will we ever learn!

I'm sure A/Q has never called anyone who has left the business a quitter! Learning how to handle and overcome real questions and objections is key for the survival of the new and not so new IBO's. As I said before, the "factsaboutquixtar" has not been very effective for use with a prospect for me. It creates more and tougher questions than it answers!

It's true that some people are looking for excuses to quit, but there are huge numbers of talented people who have decided to take their time and energy somewhere else after a having very negative experinece with A/Q. We can't bury our heads in the sand. Changes in the way IBO's are trained have to be made!

Again, Quixtar knows better than any of us what the most difficult problems are. They also know it's up to them to lead the way in getting things right.

Again, Beth what say you!

What are the biggest objections and what is Q's appraoch to deal with them?

I know thousands of IBO's are very excited to hear there will be Q regionals soon!

Thanks for the good news!

 

Editor's Note from Beth:  Greg, I responded very briefly and not very thoroughly to your question earlier today.  I need to go back through some info to come up with some of the top objections and suggestions on how to respond -- which sounds like food for a post!

But to answer your question, Quixtar would never call anyone who chooses not to be an IBO a loser or a quitter.  There are so many reasons one might discontinue their Quixtar business -- from dealing with an illness in the family to not having time right now to build it to it just not being right for them -- that we'd never make those kind of assumptions.  As I've said elsewhere, our business is open to just about anyone but isn't for everyone.  And, harkening back to a post a few months ago, prospects should be encouraged to ask questions about this opportunity to make sure BEFORE they register that they understand what this business is all about and make an informed decision.  

Tex said:
April 13, 2007 4:35 PM | #

It is amazing how so many things that appear new are really old news.

Rich Devos said exactly the same thing in his 1983 "Directly Speaking" recordings, that people who don't/quit this business are losers.

Q and all IBO's would do well to carefully listen/read those recordings and base the "new direction" on these "old ideas" that have not been implemented.

There is a wealth of good points contained in those words that are unfortunately as applicable today as they were then.

ibofightback said:
April 13, 2007 6:15 PM | #

Greg, if I'd ever heard that kind of thing on a tape or at a function it would have "stirred my soul" to turn off the tape or walk out of the function.

If I'd heard it regularly, it would have "stirred my soul" to quit. That kind of attitude is one of the biggest reasons  why some folk have a negative attitude towards our industry and our business in particular.

It's disrespectful, unprofessional, and plain disgraceful. I don't know how Quixtar can stop that kind of puerile behavior, but if they could it would make a bigger difference than anything.

TB 2 IBO said:
April 13, 2007 10:46 PM | #

Greg,

I have to say, your response was very PC.  However, I thought the whole focus on this site was to be open and honest.  Beth's response is also very PC, which I would expect from a Q* representative, regardless of her personal feelings.  Does Beth have experience building the business, or is she an employee?  Either way, it is not the truth.  Honestly if someone truly wants to build this business big they need to have the thick skin, and straight up information to deal with it and make an informed decision based on facts.  If you soft shoe around the facts of building a large organization people will not trust you.  

Your answer and Beth's answer is great for those who want to achieve "average" income in the business ($115) or perhaps some sub-par platinum level.  To be honest, your answer is what I tell prospects that only want that as a goal.  Sometimes their ambition grows from there, other times not so much.

However, I feel that if people are willing enough to read through all these posts, they are either looking to build it big, not looking for sugar coated feel good statements, or simply looking for excuses.  In any case the real truth needs to be heard (at least from my opinions and experience).  Yours can and may certainly be different, and I respect that!

The truth is this, if you truly see the opportunity and potential this business offers, then all those reasons Beth states in her answer shouldn't be excuses to "discontinue", but rather reasons why they need to build this business!  The mentality of "winning isn't everything" and sugar coating simply will not work for someone in any business owner position.

Now to address the "loser/quitter" comments:  

1) If you are 100% upfront with prospects and let them know what it will take to achieve their desired financial goals with this business BEFORE registering and they don't get in, then they are simply people who decided not to take the opportunity.--Doesn't qualify as a quitter, because they were never a starter.

2) Again being 100% upfront with prospects, and they get in (registered) and they "discontinue" their business, they can be called a quitter.  Not implying in every aspect or in the negative connotation you two are implying, but only as far as this business is concerned.

3) A loser, in my opinion, is someone who registers and quits over something insignificant or false truths.  Example:  Well, my mom said it is scam, when in fact "mom" has zero experience in ANY business let alone a Q* business.  Or I read on so-and-so's blog and they said it won't work for you.  

So instead of going to the source or even asking the sponsoring IBO (who should have the prospect best interest at heart) they simply quit based on that.  To me, that is a "loser."

Call it unprofessional, insincere, or whatever you like.  It is the truth, whether it is stage talk or not.  I will not hide this from anyone or lower my standards based on someone's perceived feelings.  Oh, didn't we have a discussion on here somewhere where it was said that no significant pins ever reached it without that education system?

Prospective IBOs need to understand this business, to any level of financial success, is not going to be a walk through the park.  But if they are willing to attempt it, they should also know YOU will be there, helping, encouraging, cheering, and LEADING them until they achieve success.  Even if it isn't the most popular help, encouragement, or advice.

Editor's Note from Beth Dornan:
Most IBOs who start their businesses have very modest goals, and yes, to them, earning an extra hundred dollars a month or so is a big deal. And you're right that many intend to build big -- but you can't build big until you've built a successful smaller business. My answer should be considered true regardless the size of the goal.

I applaud your commitment to be "100 percent upfront" about what it takes to build a Quixtar business. If someone wants to replace a job with their Quixtar business then they need to know what it will take to replace that income and that it will take hard work and effort over time. But I do draw the line at calling someone names because they choose to discontinue their Quixtar businesses. I respect your right to your opinions but please understand that your comments come very close to violating our comments policy and commitment to having "civil discourse" here in the Opportunity Zone.

Piet Strydom said:
April 16, 2007 4:44 AM | #

In two years I have never heard that phrase, either from my up-line, or from the sage.

It is enough to emphasize the positive in those people that have done it.

Greg said:
April 16, 2007 1:53 PM | #

Good for you Piet. Maybe some are starting to really get it right!  Unfortunately, a lot of damage has been done over the years by inappropriate things said by IBO's. Old memories die hard and Q has a huge job in changing our image.

Q knows exactly what has caused the problems over the the years and they know exactly the "training"  necessary to turn things around.

Tex is right! Lets re-visit what Rich had to say in "83" and actually put this message to use!

Tex said:
April 16, 2007 9:00 PM | #

Editor's Note from Beth Dornan: Most IBOs who start their businesses have very modest goals, and yes, to them, earning an extra hundred dollars a month or so is a big deal. And you're right that many intend to build big -- but you can't build big until you've built a successful smaller business. My answer should be considered true regardless the size of the goal.

Tex: In the context of how many organizations teach the business, the ability to have a small goal is very difficult. This is because what is taught is not how to retail and make a hundred dollars, as you suggest. What is taught is full participation in the tool systems, creating an overhead of several hundred dollars a month. To have a goal of a hundred dollars a month (net income) in this scenario is not logical. Sure, you have to pass through a hundred dollars a month to get to a higher net profit, but I would hardly call this a goal.

If the First Circle is designed for those who want a low overhead business and sell products, this is fine. However, if the upline then comes in and takes the first several hundred dollars a month retail profit to support their tool system overhead, the First Circle would be a disaster, in my opinion.

Greg,

Thanks for the support. It's good to know you read the "Directly Speaking" recordings, they should part of the required training at Quixtar University.

TB 2 IBO said:
April 16, 2007 10:54 PM | #

Beth,

Never in that post did I say I call people names.  I have never once uttered to a prospect, IBO, or anyone for that matter, that they are considered quitters or losers.

They are not names, they are simply labels.  Also, so you understand me correctly and the intent of my original comment, I will explain a bit further.

The phrase I used (which might I add did not say anything about losers) is meant not to call names or even label people or an individual.  The intent is to instill a thick skin on the new IBO who receives no after no after no.  The new IBO needs to understand that you can not talk someone into the business and expect results.  The ones that will build it will identify themselves, and those that don't will also do the same.

So in conclusion, it is not meant to hurt the feelings of a wide array of people, but rather to help the new guy/gal arm themselves with knowledge and motivation.

Piet Strydom said:
April 17, 2007 2:55 AM | #

Greg said: Lets re-visit what Rich had to say in "83" and actually put this message to use!

Piet says: What I don't get is these repeated calls to go back to Rich's tapes, when we have so many posters here that demonstrate that many of the things that Rich complained about, is no longer an issue.

Bear in mind that if you have three million people (Having renewed at least once!) in a business, there are some people that are going to make wayward comments.

Deal with it, get over it and go on.

TB 2 IBO said:
April 17, 2007 1:49 PM | #

Piet,

I mostly agree with you in your last comment.

However, as much as I don't want to fan the tool fire that keeps Tex posting on here.  Those recordings do offer some really good advice, encouragement, and straight out passion for this business.

It is wise to listen to the recordings or read them.

Like you, I also grow tired of the continual reference to them.  Well, more so that there can not be a thread posted here without Tex rambling about the tools. (no offense Tex)

Tex said:
April 17, 2007 8:26 PM | #

Piet says: What I don't get is these repeated calls to go back to Rich's tapes, when we have so many posters here that demonstrate that many of the things that Rich complained about, is no longer an issue.

Tex says: They did fix many of the issues Rich brought up, but not the "big one", the tool profits. I am dealing with it, and when it is fixed, I will get over it and move on.

TB 2 IBO, thanks for your agreement the "Directly Speaking" recordings contain much useful information. However, I will keep posting here regardless if you "fan the fire" or not. When Q addresses these issues, I will be the first to not "ramble on" about the tool profits.

Glam said:
April 17, 2007 11:59 PM | #

****All of Rich's audio should be in MP3 format on Quixtar's homepage. At the very least, for IBO's and definitely Quixtar U.

Hurry up and get Q*U open for enrollment. I can't wait to see this grow.

God Bless..

Tex said:
April 18, 2007 5:25 PM | #

I second that motion.

Glam said:
April 19, 2007 10:41 AM | #

Thanks Tex.  

I will also strongly recommend  more of "Where did we come from and where are we going" info for the new IBO and tenured vets in the form of MP3 and video presentations.  Highlight RICH and JAY's talks and presentations and move into the now with the changing of the guard.

I'm sure this will be apart of QUIXTAR U's curriculum.

How about today? Open up Q* U to the masses? It's already a success with the IBOs using it now.  

Piet Strydom said:
April 19, 2007 12:49 PM | #

Tex said: What is taught is full participation in the tool systems, creating an overhead of several hundred dollars a month.

Piet Says: Nonsense. That is another generalisation, and if it is your experience, it is definitely not the experience with our BSG.

Chris O. said:
April 19, 2007 7:47 PM | #

Tex,

I have to agree with Piet on this one--your generaliz